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	<title>Comments on: Obama&#8217;s Oahu spirit: too cool to handle scientific hot potato?</title>
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	<description>Reviewing scientific paradigms and other general beliefs in the light of the scientific amd professional literature</description>
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		<title>By: Nick Naylor</title>
		<link>http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/obamas-oahu-spirit-too-cool-to-handle-a-science-hot-potato.htm/comment-page-1#comment-6583</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick Naylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jan 2009 23:25:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/?p=1083#comment-6583</guid>
		<description>TS, I&#039;ve said this before. If we don&#039;t look at the &quot;incomplete&quot; human genome project and those HIV paradigm critics outside the &quot;club&quot;, what exactly is it that will push &quot;science guardians&quot; into an ascendant mode?

A great victory of the truthiness attack dogs IMO is to contain &quot;middle ground&quot; critics writing about current research findings on HERVs, which have become eerily reminiscent of the 1980 to 85 HTLV papers.

But the point is to get beyond &quot;harmless passenger&quot; and reach the light of &quot;function&quot;; satisfy innate human curiosity: wtf is going on here?

The &quot;tipping point&quot; will come by acknowledging all those messy technical papers that cause &quot;retirees&quot; apparently to glaze over. I get the point, enough is enough, but the job on the science side is NOT FINISHED. 

I think it&#039;s not about charges into &quot;machine gun fire&quot;, but the hard work of getting out the entire record on retroviral research, 1970 to present. And how that record tracks with the politics of cancer and other chronic diseases that correlate with various contaminated environments. 

Of course the &quot;fortress of vested interest&quot; compromises just about everything in medicine that has to do with &quot;aids-like&quot; diseases, especially when suggestive evidence leads to a powerful industry. Physicians take serious economic risks when perceived as being &quot;overzealous advocates&quot; for a certain type of patients - the war on altmed conspiracy :o)

So who are the troops? I think in line with the points Michael G made. When it comes to chronic illness, there&#039;s a growing realization among ordinary people that MDs are not really doing thorough evidence-based differential diagnoses. (There&#039;s no time or &quot;economic incentive&quot; apologists say. Or a general handwaving: physicians simply can&#039;t pinpoint toxins and their effects.) 

****

It has been put before us by Dr Maniotis: what (retro)genomic processes contribute to the &quot;molecular signature&quot; of &quot;HIV&quot;? That question can be answered thanks to the tons of HIV/HERV papers. Reviews of functional assays involving the transcription of so-called retroviral genes, each and every one of them, need to adequately interpret techno blah blah and most importantly, grab the reader&#039;s attention. 

Quite a challenge, but after all is said and done, worth it AND exciting.

****

Thanks to our plummeting economy perhaps &quot;precise failures&quot; within institutionalized medicine and their adverse effects on &quot;health-care&quot; costs and patient &quot;insurability&quot; will no longer be ignored.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TS, I&#8217;ve said this before. If we don&#8217;t look at the &#8220;incomplete&#8221; human genome project and those HIV paradigm critics outside the &#8220;club&#8221;, what exactly is it that will push &#8220;science guardians&#8221; into an ascendant mode?</p>
<p>A great victory of the truthiness attack dogs IMO is to contain &#8220;middle ground&#8221; critics writing about current research findings on HERVs, which have become eerily reminiscent of the 1980 to 85 HTLV papers.</p>
<p>But the point is to get beyond &#8220;harmless passenger&#8221; and reach the light of &#8220;function&#8221;; satisfy innate human curiosity: wtf is going on here?</p>
<p>The &#8220;tipping point&#8221; will come by acknowledging all those messy technical papers that cause &#8220;retirees&#8221; apparently to glaze over. I get the point, enough is enough, but the job on the science side is NOT FINISHED. </p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s not about charges into &#8220;machine gun fire&#8221;, but the hard work of getting out the entire record on retroviral research, 1970 to present. And how that record tracks with the politics of cancer and other chronic diseases that correlate with various contaminated environments. </p>
<p>Of course the &#8220;fortress of vested interest&#8221; compromises just about everything in medicine that has to do with &#8220;aids-like&#8221; diseases, especially when suggestive evidence leads to a powerful industry. Physicians take serious economic risks when perceived as being &#8220;overzealous advocates&#8221; for a certain type of patients &#8211; the war on altmed conspiracy <img src='http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_surprised.gif' alt=':o' class='wp-smiley' /> )</p>
<p>So who are the troops? I think in line with the points Michael G made. When it comes to chronic illness, there&#8217;s a growing realization among ordinary people that MDs are not really doing thorough evidence-based differential diagnoses. (There&#8217;s no time or &#8220;economic incentive&#8221; apologists say. Or a general handwaving: physicians simply can&#8217;t pinpoint toxins and their effects.) </p>
<p>****</p>
<p>It has been put before us by Dr Maniotis: what (retro)genomic processes contribute to the &#8220;molecular signature&#8221; of &#8220;HIV&#8221;? That question can be answered thanks to the tons of HIV/HERV papers. Reviews of functional assays involving the transcription of so-called retroviral genes, each and every one of them, need to adequately interpret techno blah blah and most importantly, grab the reader&#8217;s attention. </p>
<p>Quite a challenge, but after all is said and done, worth it AND exciting.</p>
<p>****</p>
<p>Thanks to our plummeting economy perhaps &#8220;precise failures&#8221; within institutionalized medicine and their adverse effects on &#8220;health-care&#8221; costs and patient &#8220;insurability&#8221; will no longer be ignored.</p>
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		<title>By: Truthseeker</title>
		<link>http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/obamas-oahu-spirit-too-cool-to-handle-a-science-hot-potato.htm/comment-page-1#comment-6477</link>
		<dc:creator>Truthseeker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 07:09:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/?p=1083#comment-6477</guid>
		<description>Michael, it would be more convincing if you didn&#039;t get so upset at the suggestion that dissidents in HIV/AIDS aren&#039;t getting anywhere against the fortress of vested interest, since it only suggests that you fear that the point is valid.  Whether the future will be any different no one can know, but there has to be a tipping point, and there has to be a way in which it can tip.
Nothing you have listed suggests such a thing, and nor does it suggest that the accumulation of arrows fired into the fort have hit anyone important.  Can you name anyone at all who has been defeated by a dissident incursion?   Most of your listed triumphs are exaggerations.  Where is the path through the defenses of the status quo?  

Now Christine Maggiore is reported to have died by the Los Angeles Times.   A fairly long list could be made of this kind of bad luck constantly suffered by the reformers in HIV/AIDS, including the deaths of Serge Lang and Eliza Jane, and now Christine Maggiore for God&#039;s sake.   

To deal with such setbacks and drive through the sixteen foot thick walls of the castle will take more than boosterism and calling realism bad coaching.   It will take hard thinking and cunning, based on a careful assessment of where the cracks are.  We weren&#039;t suggesting that people should give up, merely that they should recognize the fight is a tough one, a very tough one indeed.     It will not be won through blind enthusiasm, that&#039;s for sure, or any kind of emotional support for those flagging in their dterminatin to speak out against this evil empire, which certainly doesn&#039;t include us.  

The time for that kind of rallying the troops for another assault over the top into machine gun fire is over.  Dissidents will have to think very hard to win ground, even in baby steps.   Frontal assault won&#039;t do it, that&#039;s for sure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael, it would be more convincing if you didn&#8217;t get so upset at the suggestion that dissidents in HIV/AIDS aren&#8217;t getting anywhere against the fortress of vested interest, since it only suggests that you fear that the point is valid.  Whether the future will be any different no one can know, but there has to be a tipping point, and there has to be a way in which it can tip.<br />
Nothing you have listed suggests such a thing, and nor does it suggest that the accumulation of arrows fired into the fort have hit anyone important.  Can you name anyone at all who has been defeated by a dissident incursion?   Most of your listed triumphs are exaggerations.  Where is the path through the defenses of the status quo?  </p>
<p>Now Christine Maggiore is reported to have died by the Los Angeles Times.   A fairly long list could be made of this kind of bad luck constantly suffered by the reformers in HIV/AIDS, including the deaths of Serge Lang and Eliza Jane, and now Christine Maggiore for God&#8217;s sake.   </p>
<p>To deal with such setbacks and drive through the sixteen foot thick walls of the castle will take more than boosterism and calling realism bad coaching.   It will take hard thinking and cunning, based on a careful assessment of where the cracks are.  We weren&#8217;t suggesting that people should give up, merely that they should recognize the fight is a tough one, a very tough one indeed.     It will not be won through blind enthusiasm, that&#8217;s for sure, or any kind of emotional support for those flagging in their dterminatin to speak out against this evil empire, which certainly doesn&#8217;t include us.  </p>
<p>The time for that kind of rallying the troops for another assault over the top into machine gun fire is over.  Dissidents will have to think very hard to win ground, even in baby steps.   Frontal assault won&#8217;t do it, that&#8217;s for sure.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Geiger</title>
		<link>http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/obamas-oahu-spirit-too-cool-to-handle-a-science-hot-potato.htm/comment-page-1#comment-6474</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Geiger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:30:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/?p=1083#comment-6474</guid>
		<description>And may I remind you, TS, just how far we have come in just the last short couple of years? 

Several more websites gaining prominence, including your own. 

Celia&#039;s Nuclear Bomb landing on the NIH in the form of her article in Harpers.

Liams exposure of the ICC scandal.

Adverts and stories in the independent and college and gay media.

Ever increasing coverage on radio, tv, magazines, and the net.

Dozens of YouTube videos. 

Several more books written and released.

All discussion of hiv as the cause of aids shut down on major science websites. 

Thousands upon thousands more now aware that hiv/aids is a bankrupt paradigm. 

Exposure of the dissident issues being put into many articles in the worldwide press. 

The Semmelweis Awards.

More and more learning about it every day.

And On, and On and On and On we go steadily forward. 

Just like a baby learning to walk on its wobbly little legs, it puts out a left foot and falls down. It stands again and puts out a left foot followed by a right foot and it stands. It puts out a left followed by the right followed again by the left, and soon, it walks, and soon thereafter, it runs ever faster until it matures. 

So lets keep walking, TS, because the next thing you know, it is a fully grown marathon winning runner whose very name is a household word.  

That, eventually, though I do not know when, is indeed our collective future as regards exposing the hiv/aids paradigm as bankrupt nonsense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And may I remind you, TS, just how far we have come in just the last short couple of years? </p>
<p>Several more websites gaining prominence, including your own. </p>
<p>Celia&#8217;s Nuclear Bomb landing on the NIH in the form of her article in Harpers.</p>
<p>Liams exposure of the ICC scandal.</p>
<p>Adverts and stories in the independent and college and gay media.</p>
<p>Ever increasing coverage on radio, tv, magazines, and the net.</p>
<p>Dozens of YouTube videos. </p>
<p>Several more books written and released.</p>
<p>All discussion of hiv as the cause of aids shut down on major science websites. </p>
<p>Thousands upon thousands more now aware that hiv/aids is a bankrupt paradigm. </p>
<p>Exposure of the dissident issues being put into many articles in the worldwide press. </p>
<p>The Semmelweis Awards.</p>
<p>More and more learning about it every day.</p>
<p>And On, and On and On and On we go steadily forward. </p>
<p>Just like a baby learning to walk on its wobbly little legs, it puts out a left foot and falls down. It stands again and puts out a left foot followed by a right foot and it stands. It puts out a left followed by the right followed again by the left, and soon, it walks, and soon thereafter, it runs ever faster until it matures. </p>
<p>So lets keep walking, TS, because the next thing you know, it is a fully grown marathon winning runner whose very name is a household word.  </p>
<p>That, eventually, though I do not know when, is indeed our collective future as regards exposing the hiv/aids paradigm as bankrupt nonsense.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Geiger</title>
		<link>http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/obamas-oahu-spirit-too-cool-to-handle-a-science-hot-potato.htm/comment-page-1#comment-6473</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Geiger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scienceguardian.com/blog/?p=1083#comment-6473</guid>
		<description>By the way, TS, I do love you dearly, BUT, just like any belief, negativity is contagious, and is self fullfilling in manifestation. If there is anything we can and should learn from the entire HIV/AIDS episode, it is this.

I hope that you understand how such seemingly innocuous statements from those that we respect, such as yourself, can infect many of us with a predetermined belief in our own defeat, and end up causing that very defeat. 

Just like if someone believes they require lifelong aids drugs or they will sicken and die, they will. 

If someone believes they can&#039;t swim, then they certainly will never jump into the water to even try. And without trying, they will never learn to swim. 

All of these beliefs become just another Self Fullfilling Prophecy. 

We Dissidents will NOT be able to overturn this paradigm, until and unless we first BELIEVE we can, followed by BELIEVING WE WILL, and fully intending, come whatever may, to do so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, TS, I do love you dearly, BUT, just like any belief, negativity is contagious, and is self fullfilling in manifestation. If there is anything we can and should learn from the entire HIV/AIDS episode, it is this.</p>
<p>I hope that you understand how such seemingly innocuous statements from those that we respect, such as yourself, can infect many of us with a predetermined belief in our own defeat, and end up causing that very defeat. </p>
<p>Just like if someone believes they require lifelong aids drugs or they will sicken and die, they will. </p>
<p>If someone believes they can&#8217;t swim, then they certainly will never jump into the water to even try. And without trying, they will never learn to swim. </p>
<p>All of these beliefs become just another Self Fullfilling Prophecy. </p>
<p>We Dissidents will NOT be able to overturn this paradigm, until and unless we first BELIEVE we can, followed by BELIEVING WE WILL, and fully intending, come whatever may, to do so.</p>
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